Acne Scar Treatments Archive 2
Return to the Acne Support Group in Cyberspace home page

 

  PK Reporting in - Adrianna Scheibner -- PK, 09:30:41 12/06/03 Sat

  My deep apologies for not having posted sooner - life has been very hectic.
  BUT ironically, I just returned from having dinner here in So. California with
  Dr. Scheibner herself, her husband and my boyfriend. Adrianna is visiting So.
  Calif for this week, attending to various business interests, visiting
  friends, etc. and there is much going on in terms of her efforts to FINALLY
  have her license here reinstated, sharing her scar reversal technology with
  other drs, etc. I honestly feel that her treatment method will be available
  here in US wihtin a year's time, and "Anna" and I will be working to ensure
  that this in fact happens, along with others.

  Having gotten to know Adrianna these past several months now, I can
  unequivocally state that I feel it impossible for her to have harmed or burned
  any former patient, and I've heard first hand of the scheme by her former
  office manager to fabricate phony complaints to the Calif Med Board to
  jeopardize her license, in order to keep her from practicing here and being
  present to take legal action agaisnt him for his having embezzled millions
  from her. She's just published a book which details all that occured, adn I
  fully believe her. Sorry for typos please bear with me...

  IN any case A. explained that she had gone very gently in terms of treating my
  skin given that she was concerned about how I might respond to my skin during
  the healing stage of an aggressive treatment, given my past horror stories
  with local "experts" (read former posts about my botched laser job, intended
  to fix a botched dermabrasion job....).

  I will be returning to Sydney asap to have the treatment fully done, she
  insists. I've met former patients now with flawless skin, seen hundreds of
  photos of former scar victims, etc. to make it worth my while to travel half
  way around the world to "finish up" my treatment. To those who have posted
  from Sydney, you'd be crazy not to take advantage of her expertise there
  locally. SHE IS THE REAL THING, I AM CERTAIN OF THIS, AND IS FULLY CAPABLE OF
  TREATING AND REVERSING SCARS, as is her well trained associate dr, Dr. Della
  Bruna, something like that.

  I see now about a 10-15% improvement in my skin even with this gentle
  treatment. A. says that my scars will all be gone once she retreats me. Having
  treated some 28,000 patients I trust that she knows what she's talking about.

  I feel incredibly blessed to even know this woman, she is a true humanitarian
  and undisputable the world's expert in this field.

  To those considering her treatment, I feel 100% certain that there is no risk
  to you and a high likelihood of being greatly helped.

  Hope this helps....

  PK
 

  Dr Scheibner -- HT, 09:08:13 12/06/03 Sat

  Thank you for your update PK! I cannot wait to meet Dr Scheibner in 2 weeks
  time, I was going to cancel my trip to Sydney to see her but having read your
  post I am positive she will be able to help me!

  PK Reporting in - Adrianna Scheibner -- PK, 08:58:05 12/06/03 Sat

  My deep apologies for not having posted sooner - life has been very hectic.
  BUT ironically, I just returned from having dinner here in So. California with
  Dr. Scheibner herself, her husband and my boyfriend. Adrianna is visiting So.
  Calif for this week, attending to various business interests, visiting
  friends, etc. and there is much going on in terms of her efforts to FINALLY
  have her license here reinstated, sharing her scar reversal technology with
  other drs, etc. I honestly feel that her treatment method will be available
  here in US wihtin a year's time, and "Anna" and I will be working to ensure
  that this in fact happens, along with others.

  Having gotten to know Adrianna these past several months now, I can
  unequivocally state that I feel it impossible for her to have harmed or burned
  any former patient, and I've heard first hand of the scheme by her former
  office manager to fabricate phony complaints to the Calif Med Board to
  jeopardize her license, in order to keep her from practicing here and being
  present to take legal action agaisnt him for his having embezzled millions
  from her. She's just published a book which details all that occured, adn I
  fully believe her. Sorry for typos please bear with me...

  IN any case A. explained that she had gone very gently in terms of treating my
  skin given that she was concerned about how I might respond to my skin during
  the healing stage of an aggressive treatment, given my past horror stories
  with local "experts" (read former posts about my botched laser job, intended
  to fix a botched dermabrasion job....).

  I will be returning to Sydney asap to have the treatment fully done, she
  insists. I've met former patients now with flawless skin, seen hundreds of
  photos of former scar victims, etc. to make it worth my while to travel half
  way around the world to "finish up" my treatment. To those who have posted
  from Sydney, you'd be crazy not to take advantage of her expertise there
  locally. SHE IS THE REAL THING, I AM CERTAIN OF THIS, AND IS FULLY CAPABLE OF
  TREATING AND REVERSING SCARS, as is her well trained associate dr, Dr. Della
  Bruna, something like that.

  I see now about a 10-15% improvement in my skin even with this gentle
  treatment. A. says that my scars will all be gone once she retreats me. Having
  treated some 28,000 patients I trust that she knows what she's talking about.

  I feel incredibly blessed to even know this woman, she is a true humanitarian
  and undisputable the world's expert in this field.

  To those considering her treatment, I feel 100% certain that there is no risk
  to you and a high likelihood of being greatly helped.

  Hope this helps....

  PK
 

  Acquamid -- John, 12:05:49 12/05/03 Fri

  For those guys interested I had my second ml of Acqaumid and I am extremely
  pleased with the results. This product is permanent and gives results like
  Collagen. It is also cost effective as it costs approx $500 (AUD) (I am from
  Sydney Australia) plus the surgeons fees. It is soft under the skin and not
  hard and you wouldn't even know it was there. The only thing you have to get a
  good surgeon to do it as once it is in it is permanent.

  This treatment in my view would be far more effective than Isolagen as I have
  only had 2ml and saw about at least a 75% improvement so if I had 5mls like
  Isolagen people experience much smaller % improvements plus Acquamid is much
  cheaper.

  Anyway guys I think this is extremely promising as I have had lasers,
  dermabrasions and this is the best result I have had and JJ the choice is up
  to you mate but just don't ignore the warnings would be my advice to you as
  your face is not a block of wood you can't through it away and start again.
 

  Scheibner- PK -- JJ, 06:36:54 12/05/03 Fri

  Hi
  this is my first time at the site. The reason I am posting is because I
  recently had a consult at the Scheibner Centre in Sydney and am contemplating
  having some laser done there. I was a bit worried about Dr Scheibner's med
  license being revoked etc., PK's last update was not terribly positive, but I
  do understand that collagen takes many months to repair the damaged skin. This
  aside, is there anyone that can say they have had a treatment done at this
  surgery? good or bad results? or if you have heard anything else about this
  Doctor/method. Anything would be appreciated as I dont want to end up with
  worse skin than I already have. many thanks

  Christine and Group -- Sam, 03:53:09 12/04/03 Thu

  Christine...WHO was your doctor? And where can I find him/her? I am very
  impressed with your post. I don't ever remember reading a post in which the
  person was 100% satisfied with the result. $12,000, I think, is a SMALL price
  to pay if your scars are totally gone! Congratulations!

  ps Who knows about Artecoll? And Restylane? I have an appointment on Tuesday
  with a Canadian dctor to discuss...I live on the US East Coast.

  BTW...I had a subsicion about a year ago on one large scar....NEVER again. It
  produced a horrible raised scar that is worse than the acne scar! Everyone be
  careful!

  Regards

  Sam
 

  Dr. Romano -- James, 08:55:06 12/03/03 Wed

  My experience with Dr. Romano's staff was the polar opposite of yours. I found
  the women at the front desk very freindly and helpful. I saw the esthetician
  also. She was nice, normal.

  But the deal is that artecoll does not work for acne scars.

  Did you find any help anywhere else in the Bay Area for acne scars?
 

  James Dr. Romano -- vs, 08:05:03 12/03/03 Wed

  I have also seen Dr. Romano about 6 months ago for artecoll. He said it would
  fill my scars up, he never said it wouldn't work on me.

  He was very nice, however I chose not to go to him.
  The girls at his office were very rude, especially the front desk girl and his
  estitician was a total bitch.
  I wrote dr.romano an email telling him how rude they were to me, and he never
  responded.
  Also I had billing problems with his office, the front desk girl would tell me
  one price, dr.romano would tell me a different price, and his biller would
  bill me something completely different. I got fed up and stopped going to him.
  I lost out on like 300 bucks at his office and he didnt do anything for me.
  Again, he was nice, but his office staff is full of bitches.
  His estician basically made me cry.

  Anyways..I wouldnt reccommend dr. romanos offic untill he gets new staff.
 

  Artecoll treatment -- James, 06:10:08 12/03/03 Wed

  I have fairly moderate acne scarring. Just a few on one cheek. But they have
  bothered me. In the past I have had laser surgery which does work well on
  refreshing the overall face but has a minimum impact on atrophic acnes scars.

  The on thing that absolutely worked was collegen injections. But they are not
  permanent.

  So I tried artecoll. It does NOT work for acne scars one iota. My doctor was
  upfront that it might not work but it was my descion to go ahead.

  My doctor is Dr. James Romano. He is a very well known dermatologist in San
  Francisco, and is a very nice guy.

  Anyone out here should check him out.
  James
 

  Answer for Marie -- JW, 02:16:32 12/03/03 Wed

  There is an acne scar expert in the Boston area. He is Dr. Michael Kaminer. He
  has co-authored papers for medical journals on acne scar revision. He is at
  Skin Care Physicians of Chestnut Hill. He is a really nice guy and he is an
  expert in acne scar revision. Make an appointment with him and he will tell
  you what will work best for your scarring. He does subcision, laser
  resurfacing, fillers and non-ablative laser treatments.
 

  Beth - CO2 laser resurfacing -- Cameron, 01:13:16 12/03/03 Wed

  Beth, if you can take about 10 days off in a row and you can afford it, it's a
  great option for treating scars--unless they're really deep and they need to
  be filled instead or unless they're ice pick scars. If you post a picture of
  your scarring somewhere or send one to me, I could probably tell you if it
  would be worth it.
 

  Cameron--Great Site! -- Beth, 20:16:15 12/02/03 Tue

  Thanks so much for being bold and sharing your story & photos. It really helps
  to be able to see the progress of others so that we know what to expect. No
  one likes to get a bad surprise--especially when it is our face!

  You look great and I am so glad that the last two treatments are starting to
  show some results for you. I think needling is about as brave as I'm going to
  get. The Co2 looks pretty grueling, though I'm sure that accounts for most of
  your improvement. Co2 is supposed to keep working and rebuilding for around a
  year after the treatment, so keep us posted as you continue to heal and the
  collagen builds up even more.

  Take care,

  Beth

   Acne Scar Treatment -- Marie, 20:08:27 12/02/03 Tue

  Hi everyone!

  I am new to this site, I think it is great!

  I live in the Boston, MA area and I am considering Erbium Laser Resufacing and
  possibly a collagen injection/fat augmentation for a depressed scar on my
  right cheek (from being injected with cortisone several times to destroy an
  acne cyst). I know there are scar doctors listed on this site, but some on the
  list I have already seen with no luck! Would anyone have a recommendation for
  any in the Boston area (or any New England state) so that I don't waste any
  more time? Any info you could provide on a doctor or treatment option would be
  so helpful! Thanks so much for your time!
 

  BEFORE & AFTER PICTURES - Needling and CO2 Laser Resurfacing -- Cameron,
  04:34:05 12/02/03 Tue

  I just had my forehead resurfaced on 11/20, and I'm very happy with the
  results!

  http://home.comcast.net/~camerons007/scarring/
 

  Artecoll aka Artefill -- Mike D, 23:41:03 11/30/03 Sun

  Can someone tell me about Artecoll aka Artefill? I know it's an artificial
  filler. Has anyone tried it or knows someone? It's been in Europe for years. I
  wanted to try Isolagen but it seems like most people have not had much success
  with it. A permanent filler seems like a better choice.

  Mike D.
 

  Wash,D.C. support group meeting Dec.7th -- greg, 15:31:18 11/30/03 Sun

  hey gang,
  we are having another real-life support group meeting (YIKES!) this Sunday
  December 7th here in D.C. if you're feelin brave?..
  I get emails from all over the world saying "i wish i could come but i live in
  East Jesus" so i've been urging people to start there own little groups in
  their hometown...it's actually quite easy cuz of the web....i have met so many
  people thru my group that i learned a very valuable & unexpected lesson--like
  most of you, I *mistakenly* think the scars are thee #1 defining feature about
  you/me/us....but meeting others face-to-face with scars has taught me how
  waaaaay distorted our thinking really is..it's more like the 10th thing that
  people notice....that's your pearl of wisdom for the day...your welcome;-)
  p.s.-if you can't stomach one of our meetings, read Christine's post
  below--that's what i preach--it's a multi-procedural nitemare that takes lotta
  time & money BUT it's a winnable war....only thing she left out was
  needling--that's a good cheap scar fixer-with sunken saucer scars at least-

  take care!
  Greg
 

  PK?? -- HT, 06:19:43 11/29/03 Sat

  Has anyone heard from Pk? would love hear how she is going?
 

   To Christine -- Eve, 12:04:51 11/26/03 Wed

  How much of that 18 months did you spend as "down" time? With all those
  procedures and peels so close together, didn't you have to stay indoors a lot?
  Were you able to wear makeup? Last of all, who was your doctor and where does
  he practice?
 

  christine -- sara, 09:37:51 11/26/03 Wed

  christine:
  WOW!! very few people ever post about how they have corrected their scars to
  the point where you cannot tell there were scars in the first place. who was
  your doctor? how long did you seek treatment - it sounds like a long list of
  procedures. did you work during the treatment? what are you doing for your
  skin now?

  sara
 

What Worked For Me -- Christine, 06:03:02 11/26/03 Wed

  What Worked For Me

b  I had the following:

  Uneven Pigmentation (from acne that had healed)
  Shallow Acne Scars (both cheeks and along jaw line)
  7 Deep Acne Scars (left cheek)
  2 Deep Acne Scars (right cheek)
  Overall Dull Skin

  I went to a specialist and was PRIMED for a series of procedures. Here is

  how it went...in chronological order:

  1) Tissue was taken from behind my ears to fill the deeper acne scars on both
  cheeks. (punch excision / grafting).

  2) On the less severe scars, the tissue under the scar was "released" so the
  scar was not as depressed(undermining / subscision).

  3) Retin A was used to "thicken" the skin for the best results for upcoming
  laser resurfacing. This was a crucial step.

  4) Medite C3 laser resurfacing to give me a "clear canvas" and remove all
  blemishes and discoloration.

  5) Three months of chemical peels.

  6) Retin A cycle for 6 weeks.

  7) Co2 laser resurfacing (very very light)

  8) Retin A cycle for 4 weeks.

  9) Co2 laser resurfacing again.

  The entire process was 18 months and a little under $12,000. But, you CANNOT
  TELL I ever had a single acne scar (and they were BAD). I don't have to worry
  about any fillers (ZyPlast, ZyDerm, Collagen...which never lasted more than a
  few weeks on me anyway) and my skin has a radiant look to it for the first
  time in about 14 years. (I'm 34/white/female).

  Christine
 

   Perricone 5% ALA -- Avril, 18:13:54 11/25/03 Tue

  Hi everyone!
  Quick question: where can I get some of the Perricone 5% alpha lipoic acid? I
  have looked all over online and have not been able to find it! Is there a
  dermatologist who sells it anywhere?! Thanks so much in advance!
  Best wishes,
  Avril
 

   To VS--Exoderm -- Eve, 17:07:58 11/25/03 Tue

  I wish you the VERY BEST! I am out of town a lot, but whenever I'm home I
  always check the site to see any Exoderm updates from Cityslicker. I don't
  know how extensive your scars are, but please post your experiences with Dr.
  Rullan and the procedure. Cityslicker was most helpful. I don't know if I will
  ever be able to go to California for such a drastic procedure, but as the
  adage says: "Hope springs eternal."
 

  better skin -- jorge, 00:49:31 11/25/03 Tue

  Hi,

  I JUST HEARD OF THIS PAGE SEARCHING FOR ACNE SCAR SOLUTIONS. MY SKIN IS BAD,
  SO BAD THAT I NEVER SEEN ANYBODY LIKE ME. I STARTED TO BREAKOUT WHEN I WAS 16
  AND NOW BEEING 24 I STILL HAVE A WORSTH PROBLEM; THE ACNE SCARS ARE KILLING ME
  AND I HAVEN'T HEARD ANYBODY HAVING SUCCESS WITH ANY PROCEDURE, SO WHAT HOPE DO
  I HAVE, I EVEN HEARD SOMEBODY KILLING HIMSELF BECAUSE OF THE SCARS IN HIS
  FACE. I WHICH I HAVE THE COURAGE TO DO SOMENTHING LIKE THIS BUT I DON'T. I
  DONT KNOW WHAT ELSE TO SAID BUT GOOD LUCK.
 

  Exoderm -- vs, 23:22:35 11/24/03 Mon

  OK i scheduled my exoderm appointment.

  I cant believe i'm going through with this. I'm so nervous. I hope it works
  with good results and no bad side effects or complications.

  My apt is in Jan... so till then if you hear any horror stories about exoderm
  please LET ME KNOW! sanjoseskin@yahoo.com

  take care.
 

  Needling and Subcision -- Nathan, 05:48:26 11/20/03 Thu

  I have been reading about subcision and needling for the treatment of acne
  scars, and am interested in finding out more info. Can someone tell me how to
  go about finding these services in Austin TX or the surrounding area?
 

  TO: Marie here is Dr. Jeff Rapaports website etc -- Kate, 00:40:36 11/20/03
  Thu

  http://www.jrapaport.com
  phone: 201-227-1555
  adress: 333 Sylvan Avenue, Suite 207
  Englewood Cliffs, New Jersey 07632

  GOOD LUCK!
 

  COSMODERM INJECTIONS: HUMAN BASED COLLAGEN -- Kate, 00:30:23 11/20/03 Thu

  Hi all,

  Thought you might be interested in my cosmoderm results.
  I had it injected into a depressed scar located on the right side of my
  nose-upper cheek area. I AM VERY HAPPY WITH THE AMOUNT OF FILLING AND LEVELING
  I GOT! A topical anesthetic is applied for about 10-15 min. But I don't think
  you even need it as the cosmoderm already has one in it. The injection took
  about 5 minutes. Some background on cosmoderm: It is made by Inamed.com. They
  also have cosmoplast- this contains twice the collagen as cosmoderm. The type
  and depth of scar determines what product the doctor should use. The
  technology behind these products has been used for at least 15 yrs. to grow
  new skin for burn victims. Just so you know- the cell line is derived from A
  SINGLE SOURCE- THAT IS THE FORESKIN OF A SINGLE INFANT. I have even read the
  the "donor" the maker used was his own son! THEY DO NOT USE MULTIPLE DONORS
  FOR THE CELL LINE. The maker modified the collagen harvesting process to make
  it an injectable. The collagen is GROWN IN A LAB-it is NOT from cadavers. The
  cell line they use for
  skin grafts is the same cell line that they use for the cosmoderm and
  cosmoplast. THERE HAVE NOT BEEN ANY INFECTIONS WITH THIS CELL LINE TO DATE.
  Each vial produced is tested for a multitude of diseases etc- FDA MANDATED.
  Cosmoderm and cosmoplast come in a single use needle- 1cc. If you do not have
  enough scars to treat- they can save it for you. The length they will save it
  depends on the doctor. I paid $480.00 for the single dose 1cc needle. A lot is
  left and the doc said he would save it for me for next time. I go back in two
  weeks for a check up and if need be another injection. Of course, the staying
  power of the collagen varies from person to person. I HOPE THIS LASTS AT LEAST
  2-3 mths! I got to the point where I JUST COULD NOT STAND TO LOOK AT THIS DAMN
  DEPRESSED SCAR ANYMORE-so if I can get a few months off from looking/thinking
  about it-that will be an immense relief! The injection site is pretty pink
  right now but the area was kind of red before I had the injection. So for any
  of you who need a break- like I do- please check it out at Inamed.com
  Also- be sure to read the pdf file on contraindications. I have an immune
  system condition and up to now - I COULD NOT HAVE ANY OTHER INJECTABLES- most
  have some animal component to them and that would probably affect my immune
  system in a bad way- so I am glad this product is on the market. I HOPE IT
  LASTS FOR A WHILE!
  Thanks guys
  GOOD LUCK ALL
 

  Dr. Rappaport -- Marie, 16:00:56 11/19/03 Wed

  hey guys

  I know Dr. Rappaport and his subcision has been discussed a lot...especially
  Mr. G
  Where is he and how are his results
  can anyone tell me if they had subcision with him and how were the results
  also I need his number and location I can't locate him
  I know it is in NJ
  Someone please help me with this info
 

  Frank and Needling -- Holly, 04:50:35 11/19/03 Wed

  Sounds great about you training people to perform needling.
  What about the Tacoma WA area? Any in this area? Thanks
 

  Affordable Needling - Participate In a Training Class and get a GREAT service
  -- Frank @ Transitions, 01:59:47 11/19/03 Wed

  Frank @ Transitions
  Age :
  Gender :M
  Country :USA

  Here’s a break for those who need scar needling and are upset at those
  technicians who charge outrageous prices and rip up the delicate skin. I am
  training nurses, estheticians, tattoo artists and other professionals in
  needling and I need models to looking to have their scars needled. The
  needling services will be This Friday in Northern NJ. There is a $50 equipment
  charge for up to a 1 hour service. If interested or you need information,
  contact Frank at Transitions – 845 225-5595 or e-mail me at
  transitionspmc@aol.com. In Spring 2004, we are teaching needling in Eastern,
  NY, Las Vegas, NV, Phoenix, AZ, San Jose, CA, and Florida We will be needing
  models then also. Hope this helps some. Please spread the word around so we
  can help those who can't afford to help themselves.
  Best Wishes, Frank
 

  resurfacing -- vs, 07:32:44 11/18/03 Tue

  Well with laser the first day my face was covered in vasaline and gauze...and
  I had to go in for a cleaning...they scrubbed the crust off my face with
  hydrogen peroxide solution and water. And at home..I had to make a mixture of
  distled vinegar and distiled water..dip gauze pads in the mixture...scrub my
  face and get all the crusting off...then apply THICK THICK THICK LAYERS OF
  VASALINE.

  For my dermbrasion same thing except it was more intense. Had to wash my face
  with sterile gauze pads and distled water almost every hour or 2. so like 10
  times a day i would say...and APPLY THICK THICK THICK LAYERS OF vasaline. I
  was told if i didnt apply thick thich layers of vasaline i would scar badly
  during healing...so of course i put on THICK THICK LAYERS...then washed it off
  2 hrs later...then put more on...and so on. This went on for a good 2 weeks
  with dermabrasion.

  I think the waxy/red/orange peel skin look is natural with almost every
  resurfacing. I think even cityslicker said Exoderm gave him that too. I was
  freaked out..but it went away...it just takes time.
 

  VS - resurfacing -- Cameron, 04:17:26 11/18/03 Tue

  Wow, that sounds pretty bad. Was your scarring very deep? In some areas of my
  skin, I have lots of little imperfections (as opposed to deep scarring), like
  big pores and very fine lines criss-crossing everywhere, that cause the area
  to look ugly. It seems like a resurfacing procedure would at least get rid of
  those, but I have no idea because I've never tried it. Did your aftercare
  program involve something like this:

  - Keeping a bandage on for 4 days
  - After the bandage comes off, soaking your skin for 30 minutes every 3 hours
  for 5 days
  - Applying ointment after every soak

  Do you think the orange peel look is a result of the skin not being kept moist
  while it's healing? Or is it the result of the doctor going too deep?

  Thanks!
 

  Resurfacing Cameron -- vs, 01:20:28 11/18/03 Tue

  Hey...Cameron..I've had full face laser resurfacing..Erbium laser. It cost me
  about 5 grand and I saw about 0.00001 percent improvement. It was the biggest
  waste of money ever. It took about a month for visible redness to go away, and
  pink-in some areas for maybe 6 months...but nothing too noticable.

  Then I had dermabrasion/dermasanding/dermabuffing---they use all these
  different names to describe it. My doctor used sterile sandpaper on both my
  cheeks. He went super deep, My entire head was shaking back and forth as he
  was sanding my face down. I was red and bleeding and raw for a good month I
  would saw. And honestly I dont think my skin healed completely untill 2 yes 2
  yrs after dermasanding. I had red/waxy/orange peel looking skin after
  dermabrasion for about 2 yrs. HOWEVER--it gave me the best results. My skin
  smoothed out a lot-some scars went away completely. But also this was combined
  with 4 treatments of subcision--and I believe subsicion was the biggest
factor!

  Hope my info helped.
 

  Resurfacing -- Cameron, 00:23:14 11/18/03 Tue

  I wonder how often resurfacing (using dermabrasion or lasers) is successful.
  Is it possible that only the people who had a bad experience come to these
  message boards? If the rest of them are living happily ever after, they'd have
  no need to hang around on these message boards.

  For anyone who has had a bad experience, how deep did the doctor go? Past the
  epidermis? What was your aftercare program like? How long did the bandage stay
  on, and how did you keep your skin moist and free of infection?
 

  steve exoderm -- vs, 00:00:03 11/18/03 Tue

  Steve how has your skin since exoderm? Any new updates? Is your skin tone any
  different now?
 

  Isolagen -- Peter, 20:50:42 11/17/03 Mon

  heidi,

  I am not sure who the doctor is that Matt is using. I should be hearing from
  him within a week or two about his second set of injections. When I do I will
  email him back and see if he does not mind me informing the rest of the board.

  Peter
 

  To: Daniel -- Beth, 20:09:37 11/17/03 Mon

  Hello, Daniel!

  Your story sounds like many other people's experiences here. What I am getting
  after reading all of the trial and error stuff is that it is always best to
  start with the least invasive thing first. Unfortunately it is too late for
  that since you've already done two very risky procedures, but there is always
  hope. There is a guy named Greg who has a scar support group and often posts
  on this (and other) message boards. He'd tell you that he has tried about
  everything out there and his best results (to date) have been from needling.
  (At least this is what I get out of his posts and emails.) Needling is not too
  risky and is VERY cheap. If you don't heal up well from your last erbium
  treatment, you may want to consider needling yourself. Hopefully that won't be
  necessary though. Keep us all posted on your progress. If I go through with
  the needling I will post my results here. Beth
 

 

  dermabrasion, excision, and finally 2 Erbium treatments -- Daniel, 18:40:42
  11/16/03 Sun

  Age : 24
  Gender : Male
  Country: The Great U.S.A!!!

  Hey everone...I just stumbled upon this site and want to say that it was
  pretty cool listening to everyones stories. It definetly made me feel better
  about going through what i've been going through lately. It started with me
  wanting to get rid of sime tiny pin head size scars on both cheeks...so I
  decided to check this local dermatologist out...and asked him what I could
  do...he said he recomended dermabrasion on those areas...when I asked him the
  healing time for that procedure he said....about 5-10 days. I was
  like...yes!..just in time for my junior year of college which started in 10
  days...(at the time I didn't know anything about resurfacing)...so I did
  it...and boy..that was the start of the worst few months of my life! I ended
  up healing in 10 days all right..but he never botherred to tell me that I
  would have up to 6 months of redness to deal with....nor did he tell me of the
  possiblity of worse scarring....well...about 5 weeks after the procedure my
  skin began to lighten up and I could see that he scarred me much worse than
  before...man...I was upset...so I went to a well known plastic surgeon in the
  area and he said that he wanted to excise the deep scars left from the
  dermabrasion procedure...and then laser resurface the incision marks.
  Well...its now been abotu 3 months since all of this started...and now I would
  be completely happy if I was back right where I started...with those pin head
  size scars on my cheeks. I ended up getting two treatments with the Erbium
  over the incisions....hey...anyone have any experience with the
  Erbium?...especially with spot treatments? Well..the story continues...and its
  now been about 4 days since my second treatment with the Erbium....so if
  anyone has any questions..comments or concerns...i'd be happy to listen!! Good
  luck everyone....
 

 

  Super CP Serum -- Robert, 18:37:54 11/16/03 Sun

  Oh yeah, sorry ... it's a 4 oz. bottle.
 

 

  Super CP Serum for sale -- Robert, 18:34:28 11/16/03 Sun

  FYI: I have a full bottle of Super CP Serum that I will sell if anyone is
  interested.

  Best offer gets it.
 

 

   Exoderm Update -- Cityslicker, 11:14:48 11/16/03 Sun

  On the majority of my face redness is mostly gone - close to 90%. It is a
  little redder around my eyes but it was redder around one eye from even the
  first day. One thing I was glad about, as I mentioned before, was that he did
  my entire face so my skin tone is even completely. He stopped about 1/4 inch
  from eyes and I can still see dermacation line, but only because I know it's
  there.

  I finally had a chance to visit with one brother and his wife, one sister and
  her husband, and my parents, and nobody said anything about my color.

  My scars on my face remain as previosly reported. My 2 neck scars which I was
  concerned about and thought would get little to no improvement - one is
  completely gone, and the other appears about 70% improved. I seen my personal
  physician for a follow up on my back surgery, I had previously discussed
  Exoderm with her as she had to fax Dr. Rullan some of my medical records, she
  said, she could tell a difference in my face and that she thought that I had
  gotten good results from the procedure.

  VS, I understand the nervousness. I was afraid myself, mostly fear of the
  unknown. I will try an give an occassional update when I can, but unless I see
  a radical change (which I would report), I need the passage of time before I
  can gauge further improvement. If I could financially afford to do Exoderm
  again tomorrow, I would do it in a heartbeat, without any hesitation. :-)
  Cityslicker
 

 

  Really Nervous -- vs, 12:17:08 11/15/03 Sat

  Hi everyone,

  I'm really nervous...i been asking lots of questions about exoderm to
  dr.rullan. I'm so nervous, I dont wanna get exoderm, but at the same time I
  dont wanna live with scars. Ugh! I'm getting tempted to get it done, but i'm
  so scared, i dont want my skin looking worse.

  I want to make a decision soon though. I wish more people would discuss their
  exoderm results.

  EVERYONE TALK ABOUT YOUR EXODERM EXPERIENCES PLEASE!!!
  THANKS
 

 

  PK -- cubsfan, 07:36:32 11/15/03 Sat

  I'm really hungry for an update from you...no pressure though.
 

 

  Blackheads/dirt - VS -- Cameron, 03:07:12 11/15/03 Sat

  VS, I agree with you there. That's great information. A lot of us do
  everything by the book, which I'm sure helps to an extent, including...

  - washing the face with a non-irritating "pore-cleaning" cleanser twice a day
  - washing off contaminants that settle on the skin with water periodically
  throughout the day
  - keeping the skin moisturized but not oily
  - staying out of the sun
  - sleeping on clean pillow sheets every day!
  - avoiding iodine
  - blah, blah, blah

  However, I for one, still get acne and blackheads in certain areas, and these
  areas change over time. It has migrated around over the years. Does that mean
  the areas of my face that have been dirty have changed over time? No way. It's
  that damn sebum! I guess the extent to which the sebum, or bacterial infection
  that it causes, or those outside factors that you mentioned cause the problem
  varies from one person to the next.

  Thanks for your ideas on this. They're very helpful.

  Quesion:

  What is the best way to extract a blackhead? Everything seems to either cause
  scarring or just be ineffective.
 

 

  my friends and i made a new msg board... -- meeraboots, 05:03:58 11/11/03 Tue

  its discusses OTC acne treatments that actually work

  and fitness routines for losing weight!

  http://www.meeraboots.tk
 

 

  Cameron i'm not wrong -- vs, 04:04:54 11/11/03 Tue

  Over the yrs drs have said dirt and food do not cause acne. New research is
  proving those statements wrong. You will still find drs who say food and dirt
  dont cause acne but drs on the cutting edge will prove you wrong.

  There was a Dermatologist on the morning show "The View". I forget his name
  but he wrote a book on beating acne breakouts. In his book he talks about how
  food actually causes break-outs and what food to eat and what foods not to
  eat. He also said the myth that dirty skin wont break out is false. If you go
  to sleep with a dirty face or put your face down on pillow sheets that are not
  clean, you will most likely wake up with a new zit. He even said air
  pollution, smog, oils, hair-products..etc from the day sit on your face and
  can cause your pores to clog..you need to cleanse your face before sleep.

  SO again, its my personal experience over the yrs--that a face that isn't
  cleansed is more prone to breaking out.

  Your also not suppose to touch your face during the day because bacteria gets
  transmitted to your face through your fingers.

  I'm not making this up cameron, talk to a dermatologist who is on the newest
  cutting edge of acne and he will tell you i'm correct.... Those days of saying
  foods and dirty face dont cause acne is false.... some foods to avoid are milk
  and foods like fries with lots of salt, salt with iodine makes you break out.
  CHOCOLATE HOWEVER DOESNT CAUSE ACNE HE SAID.

  SO AGAIN A DIRTY FACE CAN BE FULL OF BAD BACTERIA AND PORE CLOGGING POLLUTANTS
  AND CONTAMINENTS.... DONT LISTEN TO SOMEOMONE WHO SAYS OTHERWISE BECAUSE NEW
  RESEARCH PROVES THEM WRONG. SO WASH YOUR SKIN BEFORE BED AND CHANGE YOUR
  PILLOW CASE TO A FRESH NEW PILLOW CASE OFTEN! AND DONT GO TO SLEEP WITH A HEAD
  FULL OF HAIR PRODUCTS.

  THANKS!
 

 

  Blackheads are not caused by dirt! -- Cameron, 02:42:42 11/11/03 Tue

  Hey, blackheads are not caused by dirt, although dirty skin can make the
  problem worse. Acne and blackheads are caused by sebum.
 

 

  JOYCE KELLY -- VS, 22:21:06 11/10/03 Mon

  hi joyce kelly, the best thing for your sons blackheads in his ears is to go
  to a dermatologist and get them extracted. or you can do it your self.

  I may be wrong but i think blackheads are caused by dirt, so he maybe is not
  cleaning his ears very good. he prolly forgets to wash them when showering, i
  use my facial cleansers on my ears too. Its Clearsil Daily face wash with
  "triclosan antibacterial agent". works great

  and tell him not to stick his fingers in his ears. anyways unlike some
  dermatologists i believe dirt causes acne and black heads...so try my
  suggestion. But deffinately gets those extracted or else they will just sit
  there for ever.
 

 

  blackheads -- Mrs Joyce Kelly, 20:22:27 11/10/03 Mon

  My thirteen year old son suffers a lot with blackheads in his ears. Please
  could you recommend a treatment.

  thanks
 

 

  Dr. Rapaport -- infoHungry, 18:37:58 11/10/03 Mon

  I just want any input about Dr. Rapaport. Specially any catastrophies I should
  know. Thank you in advance.

  isolagen -- heidi, 16:39:14 11/10/03 Mon

  Peter: Do you know who the doctor is in London? Could you ask him I am very
  curious?

  Thanks
  Heidi

  To: VICTOR re: WHITE MARKS FROM C02 -- Kate, 00:36:56 11/10/03 Mon

  Hi Victor,

  I also have white skin from C02 laser and have been deperately searching for
  help with it. In your post you said you are using a special cream but you
  weren't sure of the spelling- will you PLEASE post that info. I WANT TO TRY
  IT! There are two non-invasive lasers on the market that are suppose to bring
  back your natural pigment. The lasers are NOT LIKE C02- they don't burn the
  skin off. They use intese light that reaches down to the layer where your
  melanin cells are formed. The laser is said to "WAKE UP" the dormant pigment
  cells. You can do a doctor search at the manufactures websites, the two lasers
  are called Extrac eximer by Photomedex at: http://www.photomedex.com. This
  laser is also used to treat psoriasis but is also FDA approved for
  hypopigmentation induced by C02 laser. The other laser is called Relume, made
  by Lumenis, the website is: http://www.lumenis.com- once there click on
  products, a drop down list will appear, click on Relume- that will give you
  the basics on how it works. To find a doctor who uses it- click on patient
  information icon. Can I ask what state you are from? I am in Minnesota and NO
  Minnesota doctors are listed. I thought I had a line on a local doctor who had
  the extrac but he says they didn't buy it afterall,so this same doctor strung
  me along that he was going to get the Relume and now 11 months later they tell
  me they aren't getting it! Needless to say that really TICKS me off. I hope
  you can find a doctor in your area that can help you with this- I KNOW WHAT
  YOU ARE GOING THROUGH AND IT IS REALLY HELL! Also, please post back here and
  let me know if you found one and if it helps you. I am determined to find a
  doctor who will treat me with one of these lasers.
 

  ISOLAGEN -- Peter, 01:43:07 11/08/03 Sat

  Hey to all. I have not posted on here for awhile since I have been really busy
  with school, but I thought that a lot of you would like to hear this. For the
  last few months I have been communicating with a guy from London who just
  underwent his first set of Isolagen injections. He is has been giving me
  information about the procedure and I must say I am getting very excited about
  it!!! Below is what he sentme in his last email. I hope that you all find this
  to be good news as I do.

  Hi Peter,

  I had my first set of injections in London today. First of all the put numbing
  gel on my face twice so that i couldnt really feel my face much at all. The I
  went in to see the doctor, I had photographs taken then I had to use a cotton
  bud to point out all the areas which I wanted treatment for. Iodine (red) was
  put on all the marks that I want rid of (very satisfying!). The injections of
  my cells went on for around 45 minutes and weren't very painfull, more like a
  scratch. I can see an improvement already but thats just because of swelling,
  I should see some real improvement after my second set of injections in three
  weeks. I feel very positive after more photos which I saw today, around 90%
  improved i'd say after a year. You can tell other people what ive written on
  the main board if you wish, I dont get on a computer enough to answer
  questions and things really. (My doctor is the best in europe and as been
  involved in the trials for the past 8 years, the nurse was saying that he has
  clients for this procedure flying in from singapore, spain, italy and the US!!
  Also, he himself and the nurse have both had it done. That is testamony enough
  for me!!)

  I will post more when I get some more feedback. Good luck to you all.
  Peter
 

 

  TO: MIKE DEFOREST -- Kate, 00:56:08 11/08/03 Sat

  Hi Mike,

  I saw your post from June regarding SYCREAM and I was wondering if you are
  still seeing improvement? I too have white, depressed scars and I recently
  ordered sycream. Is the normal color returning without the use of the self
  tanner? I would appreciate any info updates you have!
  Thanks!
 

 

  Correction -- vs, 19:09:46 11/07/03 Fri

  last week i was talking about therma-lift...I meant thermage--i got the 2
  mixed up... maybe its the same thing i dont know...but i meant
  thermage...sorry.

  So hows all the exoderm patients doing,,, kit..steve..city...hows your skin?
 

 

   Smoothbeam -- Kimmie, 05:23:43 11/06/03 Thu

  Age :42
  Gender :F
  Country US

  To Beth

  Thank you very much for the addtional message board! I checked it out and
  found Monkee's comments! I appreciate your help! Kimmie
 

 

  To: Kimmie -- RE: Smooth Beam -- Beth, 23:28:03 11/05/03 Wed

  I saw your request for smooth beam feedback. I just read a post from a girl at
  the message board address below who was very happy with her results. You can
  read her experience if you visit that message board. Her name is MONKEE. Good
  luck!

  http://www.enhancementmedia.com/cgi-bin/acne/index.cgi
 

 

  LeoPolda -- vs, 08:14:55 11/05/03 Wed

  Hey, the dr that does that new subsicion technique with the sharp wire is Dr.
  Noodleman and Dr. Harris From Age Defying Dermatology near Los Gatos and
  Campbell.

  www.agedefy.com

  If you want I can give you the direct number to the patient coordinator, she
  is very nice, if you tell her you wanna see dr.noodleman and that I reffered
  you--she will get you in right away, otherwise if the receptionist makes the
  apt it will take you forever to get in.
 

 

  LeoPolda -- vs, 08:11:46 11/05/03 Wed

  Hey, the dr that does that new subsicion technique with the sharp wire is Dr.
  Noodleman and Dr. Harris From Age Defying Dermatology near Los Gatos and
  Campbell.

  www.agedefy.com

  If you want I can give you the direct number to the patient coordinator, she
  is very nice, if you tell her you wanna see dr.noodleman and that I reffered
  you--she will get you in right away, otherwise if the receptionist makes the
  apt it will take you forever to get in.
 

 

  vs: N. CA Dr. who does subcision -- Leopolda, 07:24:05 11/05/03 Wed

  Hi, VS. I too live in N. CA (Bay Area). I am pretty interested in this new
  type of subcision. You're right--it does sound kind of scary, but it also
  seems to make sense. I had subcision with the nokor needle (needle with a
  little blade on the end of it), and I'm not sure I got much in the way of
  results. But I do think the premise of subcision makes sense, if it were to be
  implemented right. Anyway, I'd be really interested to know who this Dr. is
  and where he/she is.

  Thanks a lot...

  --leo
 

 

  thank you denise for your help! -- Torrie, 07:21:53 11/05/03 Wed

  You're the best!!!!!!!!!!!
 

 

  VS -- Cubsfan, 04:26:21 11/05/03 Wed

  there's only one way to find out...look into the past archives.

  I'm not trying to have a go at Dr rullan , just expressing my viewpoint on
  exoderm...there's always 3 sides to story...the third side is the truth and
  thats what we all want to know
 

 

   Smoothbeam -- Kimmie, 17:50:30 11/04/03 Tue

  Age :42
  Gender :F
  Country US

  I'm looking for some success stories from people that have had the smoothbeam
  procedure done. What were your results and did your skin get worse before it
  got better? I have really oily, oily, skin with breakouts on my chin. So far,
  I can't tell that the smoothbeam procedure has helped. Any suggestions out
  there?
 

 

   Torrie -- Denise1, 16:16:22 11/04/03 Tue

  Torrie, I havn't been using the gel long enough to make a determination on
  whether or not it "repairs". I can say that I believe that consistant use is
  key and that my skin and pores look way better. Dr. Perricone said in his book
  on acne that the combo of ALA/DMAE used consistantly over time does change the
  pore size. He made the comment that even the largest pores can change.

  All I can say is that you do see an immediate change in your skin when using
  it, and that it gets better over time. Keep in mind I am in no position to
  state specifically how far the repair work goes as I've only been using it a
  few weeks.

  Again, you should get it and try it, and if you need more work done to your
  pores, you can go the needling route.
 

 

  Response to VS -- Dr Rullan, 05:06:00 11/04/03 Tue

  Dear VS: Thanks for the info of procedures your doc in NorCal does...that
  water microdermabrasion (hydropeel) is just now being introduced- he sounds
  like a progressive doc...and I like his "thinking outside the box" approach to
  subcision. As you note, I've never admitted to doctoring the photos...as all
  of us, you fix brightness, tones and clarity...Is this doctoring the photos?
  My weakness was not having a great camera back then, but now I do. We do need
  more research into Exoderm and all else as well...we don't need any more
  studies showing that this or that works..we need comparative studies..showing
  what work better and why.
  ..please continue questioning and looking for the best techniques...cost wise
  as well as down time...and home-based remedies that complement more aggresive
  treatments.
  take care, Dr Rullan.
 

 

   Denise -- Torrie, 04:54:48 11/04/03 Tue

  Thanks. can you clarify whether or not the demming gel just tightens pores or
  repairs them??
  I will give it a try only if I am actually repairing the skin permanently, not
  just tightening and toning. Have you seen any permanent improvements from the
  gel? I know it must be hard to tell since you've been using so many things but
  you seem detailed oriented about your whole process so I trust your apprasial
  of the gel .
  thanks again, torrie
 

 

  hey cubsfan -- vs, 01:39:35 11/04/03 Tue

  is that true? I dont remember reading anything saying the pics were touched
up.
 

 

  Torrie -- Denise1, 16:19:28 11/03/03 Mon

  Torrie: You can try the Pure Deming gel and see how it works and if it doesn't
  effect your pores or scarred pores enough, I suppose you could always go for
  needling. I did needling before I found out about it. It is a superior
  product, though. I think the consensus with everyone who is using it is that
  it really tones and tightens the skin and the pores.

  Keep in mind that some scarred pores are small pitted scars. I would think
  that with those, only needling could help.
 

 

  my views on exoderm -- cubsfan, 10:57:55 11/03/03 Mon

  exoderm is not worth it...too much down time, too much risk, too costly and
  not enough objective research has been done to suggest its effectiveness on
  acne scars....plus most of the before and after pictures you see around of
  exoderm patients are touched up...including the pictures on dr rullans
  website...and even he addmitted to this in his post like a year ago...this is
  my opinion on Exoderm.
 

 

  Just Some Coments -- vs, 08:35:56 11/03/03 Mon

  Hey Dr. Rullan and all

  Theres a dr here in norcal who uses Therma-Lift. I guess after a series of
  treatments it tightens and lifts the skin. For example if you have droopy
  eyelids and eyebrows, it lifts the eyebrows, and if you have droopy skin near
  your neck, it will lift the skin to show your jaw line. I think it works by
  tightening the collagin. I think this analogy makes some sense-- imagine your
  collagin is long straight spaghetti--the therma-lift causes the straight
  strands to curl, shorten and tighten causing the skin to lift. Thats what some
  dermatologist on oprah said. Also, I dont think it works as-well on acne scars
  as it does on sagging skin. But i really dont know for sure, i never had that
  done.

  My dr here in san jose area also does something called a hydropeel I think its
  called. The nurse was telling me its kinda like microdermabrasion, except the
  machine has water, and the dr can control the pressure and how hard he pusshes
  the wand against your face, and he can go really deep, even make you bleed
  like dermabrasion. The water lets him go really deep untill you bleed.
  Intersting huh.

  Another thing he does, is this new way of subsicion. This is going to freak
  you guys out, cause it scared me when he told me. For all of you who dont
  know, in normal subsicion you take a special needle, i forget what its called,
  and go under each scar and cut up the scar tissue. Well the new way he does
  subsicion is taking a long sharp wire instead of the normal needle. Sticking
  it in your face and looping it all the way around your skin in a circle until
  he comes out the same hole, then he pulls the sharp wire and gets an even cut
  layer all accross your skin as the wire comes out the same hole he inserted.
  Kinda like taking a string for those of you who have done clay pottery, and
  cutting the clay in half with string. Anyways, it sounds weird, but he said
  the results are much better than normal conventional subsicion. But to me that
  just sounds scary, taking a long sharp wire and running it through your face
  in a circle and pulling it, causing an entire layer of skin to lift up, i
  dunno.

  I never done any of those, just wanted to comment on them :)
 

 

  Just Some Coments -- vs, 08:34:21 11/03/03 Mon

  Hey Dr. Rullan and all

  Theres a dr here in norcal who uses Therma-Lift. I guess after a series of
  treatments it tightens and lifts the skin. For example if you have droopy
  eyelids and eyebrows, it lifts the eyebrows, and if you have droopy skin near
  your neck, it will lift the skin to show your jaw line. I think it works by
  tightening the collagin. I think this analogy makes some sense-- imagine your
  collagin is long straight spaghetti--the therma-lift causes the straight
  strands to curl, shorten and tighten causing the skin to lift. Thats what some
  dermatologist on oprah said. Also, I dont think it works as-well on acne scars
  as it does on sagging skin. But i really dont know for sure, i never had that
  done.

  My dr here in san jose area also does something called a hydropeel I think its
  called. The nurse was telling me its kinda like microdermabrasion, except the
  machine has water, and the dr can control the pressure and how hard he pusshes
  the wand against your face, and he can go really deep, even make you bleed
  like dermabrasion. The water lets him go really deep untill you bleed.
  Intersting huh.

  Another thing he does, is this new way of subsicion. This is going to freak
  you guys out, cause it scared me when he told me. For all of you who dont
  know, in normal subsicion you take a special needle, i forget what its called,
  and go under each scar and cut up the scar tissue. Well the new way he does
  subsicion is taking a long sharp wire instead of the normal needle. Sticking
  it in your face and looping it all the way around your skin in a circle until
  he comes out the same hole, then he pulls the sharp wire and gets an even cut
  layer all accross your skin as the wire comes out the same hole he inserted.
  Kinda like taking a string for those of you who have done clay pottery, and
  cutting the clay in half with string. Anyways, it sounds weird, but he said
  the results are much better than normal conventional subsicion. But to me that
  just sounds scary, taking a long sharp wire and running it through your face
  in a circle and pulling it, causing an entire layer of skin to lift up, i
  dunno.

  I never done any of those, just wanted to comment on them :)
 

 

  Dr. Rullan updates -- Dr Rullan, 06:01:45 11/03/03 Mon

  To all: It's been months since I checked in..I had to laugh when I read
  "cityclicker's" diary of his exoderm and how strangers reacted to his mask! It
  reminded me of my own mother-in-law's experience...she also had an
  exoderm..and while still covered with that green mask, had to answer the front
  door to my house(everyone was busy) and put on a plastic shopping bag over her
  head...the guy at the door was picking something up...and was quite
  shocked...he thought it was a some kind of joke.

  Anyway...RADIANCE is now available..it's a permanent (7 years) injectable
  implant for acne scars and wrinkles. It's pretty easy to use...the cost will
  vary..from $750 to $1500 per 1cc....How it fits in to the overall acne scar
  sequence will vary from person to person. ARTECOLL/FILL will be soon available
  (possibly January 2004). I've used RESTYLANE AND PERLANE and they're easy to
  use and should last only 1-3 months longer than Collagen...although you'll
  hear claims of up to 1 year.

  Our next research is heading towards non-ablative measures such as Therma-Lift
  and the Pan G non-surgical facelift that uses myofacial,sonopeel and
  sonofacial using a machine called MEDUCE. Has anyone heard or tried these? Has
  anyone used Strivectin? Hope to hear from you all, Dr. Rullan.
 

 

  50% tca peels -- elizabeth rohan, 05:02:49 11/03/03 Mon

  If anyone is interested in tca peels they are available
  at a reasonable price from ebay and loganwood skincare.
 

 

   Question for Denise -- Torrie, 02:08:59 11/03/03 Mon

  hi denise. i saw that you reccomended the demming gel for large pits and
  scarred pores on another board. I thought that i had read you had better results on
  those pit-pores from needling. Now if i can get rid of these pits with the
  demming gel i would rather do that than go throught the needling which i had
  planned on doing for the pits based on your reccomendation. Can you clarify
  which you think works better? Has the demming gel got rid of any pits
  completely and permanently? thank you denise I appriciate it.
 

 

  Exoderm -- vs, 19:55:47 11/02/03 Sun

  Well I've been talking to Dr. Rullan to answer remaining questions I have
  about exoderm. I'm slowly feeling better about it.

  Steve, so are you saying your skin improved or you got deeper scars after
  exoderm? I didnt understand your statement. How does your skin look now, your
  skin texture, your skin color, any marks of demarcation? How does it all look?
  Any new scarring or odd pigmentation problems or texture problems?
 

 

  Hi -- Steve, 18:47:05 11/02/03 Sun

  JUst to comment on City SLickers situation. Before exoderm i didnt suffer from
  very huge and deep scars.. But alot of Pits, Visible Pores.. I MEAN A LOT..
  And they were fairly deep too..

  You have to remember that Dr. Rullan had been doing the exoderm for less than
  one year when i got mine done, so his exoderm techinques werent as up to date
  as they are today.. Theres no doubt in my mind that people who get Exoderm
  done today will probably see more improvement than i did, since Dr. Rullan is
  constantly updating is techinques..
 

 

  For Cam -- Robert, 17:40:10 11/02/03 Sun

  Cam, we are here to help. How serious is your condition? And what have you
  tried as a treatment, if anything?
 

 

   Cross Method for Scars -- Rob, 13:58:32 11/02/03 Sun

  I was wondering if anyone has had any experience with the cross treatment
  using TCA. I have read so much about it but have not heard from anyone who has
  actually done it. If you have can you please let me know about the procedure
  and if you are happy with the results. Thanks!
 

 

   newbie -- cam, 06:13:44 11/02/03 Sun

  i'm new an down about my skin can someone help
 

 

   Smoothbeam -- Kimmy, 05:29:57 11/02/03 Sun

  Age : 42
  Gender :F
  Country :US
  I've just had my 3rd smoothbeam treatment. I have to say I'm disappointed.
  Instead of getting better, my chin area actually got worse. I don't know if
  this is a reaction and my skin is just spewing out the impurities or what. Has
  anyone else had a bad reaction to the smoothbeam? In all the research I did on
  smoothbeam, I did not see one side effect saying that your skin could get
  worse before it gets better. Have I altered my skin for the worse? Help!
 

 

   Smoothbeam -- Kimmy, 05:28:52 11/02/03 Sun

  Age : 42
  Gender :F
  Country :US
  I've just had my 3rd smoothbeam treatment. I have to say I'm disappointed.
  Instead of getting better, my chin area actually got worse. I don't know if
  this is a reaction and my skin is just spewing out the impurities or what. Has
  anyone else had a bad reaction to the smoothbeam? In all the research I did on
  smoothbeam, I did not see one side effect saying that your skin could get
  worse before it gets better. Have I altered my skin for the worse? Help!
 

 

   VS - Exoderm -- Cityslicker, 21:59:16 11/01/03 Sat

  VS - my skin tone is fair complexion. I sunburn easily and my face stays
  slightly red anyway, as I work outside year round. I'm classic fair skinned,
  redish-brown hair, with a red beard. I always sunburn and only tan slightly.
  Freckled when I was a kid, perfect candidate for Exoderm as far as skin tone.
  I re-assessed my skin again this mornin' and perhaps should re-state my
  redness is probably closer to 85% decreased, but feel comfortable talking to
  people and not concerned about it. My sister invited me over for dinner
  tonight, I'll see if she mentions anything.

  Yes, Dr. Rullan uses a little hand tool. I believe he stated it was called a
  cruet, if I remember correctly. It felt like a razor, but your skin is so
  sensitive to touch after the mask comes off. I asked him to show it to me
  while he abraided the scars. It's just a slender hand tool with an eye loop on
  the end. Nothing like I envisioned while he abraided. Actually, the term
  abraid actually sounds too severe, he just lightly scrapes each scar with the
  hand tool til it bled, which happens pretty easily after you've had the
  Exoderm peel. The tool is slender and would easily fit in your pocket. Not
  much longer than a pair of tweezers, but thicker like a pick that you would
  use to pick pecans from a shell, but with an small eyeloop instead of a
  pointed pick if memory serves me correctly. I have a similair tool at the
  house, I bought to position over a pimple to relieve the buildup.

  As far as would dermabraiding the scar be cheaper than the exoderm liquid I
  have no reference as I've not seen any results to compare with. If your
  talking dermabraision versus Exoderm procedure which would give you a better
  result for the money, I could only speculate that dermabrasion by itself may
  have given better results as it can probably penetrate deeper on individual
  scars, but then you have additional risk of scarring. In my area dermabrasion
  runs $5000 for full face which is approx. what I've spent all told on Exoderm.
  In the end it was just a personal preference that I felt safer with the
  Exoderm.

  I was expecting and hoping for 80%-90% improvement only because everyone that
  has seen my scars always stated ohhh... they're not really that bad or
  noticeable, though Dr. Rullan stated that he was shooting for about 70% which
  may eventually come to pass several months later or after additional
  touch-ups. If I didn't answer your question please re-phrase it and I'll try
  again. Regards. :-) Cityslicker
 

 

  Thanks Cityslicker -- VS, 19:12:21 11/01/03 Sat

  Thanks citysliker for that exoderm update.

  I'm still thinking about exoderm.

  Dr Rullan didnt sand your face, he used a hand held tool to scrape the scars
  correct?

  Do you think the exoderm phenol solution is important on achieving good
  results on acne scars, or could the scars
  be abraded with normal dermabrasion for much cheaper?

  what kinda skin tone do you have?

  thanks!

  sanjoseskin@yahoo.com
 

 

   Update and Exoderm Update: -- Cityslicker, 09:28:58 11/01/03 Sat

  Been extremely busy last several weeks preparing for back surgery which I had
  last Tuesday. Still have pain and stiffness that Dr. said would linger for 3-4
  weeks and then should start to improve and said I should do well. He went in
  thru the front of my neck with almost a 2 inch scar. Wasn't expecting that,
  thought he would go from the side of my neck, another visible scar to contend
  with. Though, he did go directly into a crease line and he said it wouldn't be
  noticeable in a year. He said I had multiple bone spurs which he cleaned out
  and he did a de-compression on C-5-C-6, and did a small de-compression on
  C-6-C-7. He said it was so close to my spinal cord he was afraid to do to much
  in that area. Hopefully, I'll improve as projected.

  My Exoderm update. I went by my neighbors house at about 10 days, he had
  stopped by the house and I didn't answer, but as soon as it got dark I thought
  I could sneak it by him and walked across the street. First words out of his
  mouth (and it was 8:30 p.m., dark in Texas) was what happened to your face,
  did you get sunburned??? I just said yeah, I've been on vacation and just got
  back from San Diego. My redness started to fade at 3 weeks but was still
  fairly red, probably 50% reduction. At 4 weeks my redness had faded about
  75-80%. One good thing about my treatment, Dr. Rullan did my entire face, all
  the way up into my hairline and down past my chin. A couple of nurses said I
  looked flushed from my surgery, but I told them I had a chemical peel. Today,
  at about 4 1/2 weeks I'd say close to 90% reduction in redness and not even
  concerned about it. Could pass as mild sunburn, though as I mentioned a couple
  of days ago 2 nurses did notice a redness in my face. I've been going out
  everywhere since day one. I only avoided my neighbors for 10 days but after
  that I've seen my neighbors several times. I'm still off work due to my back
  surgery, but felt comfortable mostly at 4 weeks could have pulled it off
  without much question from anybody. Haven't seen any family in a month, but no
  longer avoiding them, just had have no opportunity to see them.

  Tio - yes, there is a slight orange peel from the Exoderm. It is just a slight
  graininess that is sporadic in different places where pores have shrunk but
  not completely eliminated. It's noticeable on close inspection but not a major
  concern for me.

  Eve, yes, Exoderm is still the treatment that I've had the best results with.
  My Fat Transfer with Dr. Capriotti were $1500 for 3 treatments, unfortunately,
  I lost about 20% of the fullness in the last 2 weeks on my left side. I'm
  disappointed, but hoping what improvement I have will not deteriorate much
  further, but can only hope at this point. My right side has held mostly and
  can live with those results on that side, but time will tell on my final
  results.

  Dr. Capriotti was comparable in price to Dr. Rullan. Dr. Rullan charges $3750
  with chemo-brasion and 2 free touch-ups. Dr. Capriotti charges $3800 or $4000,
  I don't remember which but does not do free touch-ups or chemobrasion, he does
  do the powdered mask which is an essential part of the Exoderm treatment that
  must be worn for 7-8 days. Everyone I spoke with does the powdered mask.

  My skin texture has changed some as skin continues to repair itself, its
  similair to anybody that has had a peel of any kind, your skin is always
  smoother immediately after the peel. My exoderm improvement I would still rate
  close to 45%-50% from where my scars were. I lost a little improvement in my
  neck area where I thought originally was 70%-80% has diminished slightly to
  about 60%-70%.

  I haven't noticed a considerable change better or worse in my other scars. The
  majority of my class 1 scars I got a moderate to signifcant improvement. Class
  2 scars I got a minor to moderate improvement.

  Overall, shallow scars improved significantly, the more deeper the scar the
  less improvement. One of the reasons I may be rating a greater improvement
  than Steve is he may have had more deeper or significant scars than mine. If
  your scars are minor to moderate you should get a fairly good improvement, if
  your scars are moderate to severe, not as well. I've had a chance to review my
  face in several mirrors that I used to check myself in and there is a distinct
  and definate improvement. I have several larger scars with not as significant
  of improvement, but I'm hopeful that with time and additional touch-ups these
  will continue to improve as well. The crowsfeet are still completely
  eliminated and forehead lines about 20%-30% visible. Take care everyone. :-)
  Cityslicker
 

 

  Cityslicker--Dr. Capriotti in Houston -- Eve, 05:32:27 11/01/03 Sat

  I am still intrigued with the Exoderm procedure you have done through Dr.
  Rullan. How are you feeling now about the procedure? Are you continuing to
  improve? Is the redness improving? You mentioned having fat transfers from Dr.
  Capriotti. Were they expensive? He also does the Exoderm lift, but it doesn't
  seem that he uses the powdered mask that Dr. Rullan uses. I am wondering if
  that would make a difference. Does he charge less than Dr. Rullan? I would
  prefer to go to California, but it would be more cost effective for me to find
  someone locally.

  I realize you may not be checking in much lately, but hope to see a post from
  you soon. I think many of us are interested in your progress. It was most
  considerate of you to go into so much detail. I will be out of town for
  awhile, but hope to have access to a computer to check out the site. I am
  hoping to have something done before this summer, if possible.
 

 

  Jack cool off -- vs, 17:18:48 10/30/03 Thu

  My bad, KIT is a guy not a girl, I keep confusing that

  But who the heck are you JACK, I was trying to encourage posts, seems like
  posting has died down lately.

  JACK you can get step outa my face and mind your own business.

  Dear kit, you havent mosted in months, I've read your last posts you Posted
  months ago, contrary to what Jack says. Please come back and post.
 

 

  VS / kit -- jack, 05:05:14 10/30/03 Thu

  VS,

  Stop telling everyone to post if you're not going to pay more attention to
  these boards. First of all Kit is a HE not a SHE. Secondly, he has posted a
  couple of things after he got back from his exoderm and explained how he was
  busy and hasn't had time to post. try looking in the archives for his opinion
  on the exoderm.
 

 

  Hey you all -- vs, 00:00:30 10/30/03 Thu

  ok I've asked this a few times the last few days, but its like no one is
  responding. What ever happend to KIT, she was on this post everyday, gets
  exoderm, then never responds again?

  Also all the people who recently got exoderm please continue posting on your
  progress and results, as I am considering exoderm.

  Please continue to post people, its so important.

  thanks.
 

 

   cystic acne -- kitty, 20:32:35 10/29/03 Wed

  This is response for Natalie about her cystic acne. My problem sounded so
  similiar to yours that I had to respond to you. I usually just listen on this
  board. Im 34yrs old and have been dealing with cystic acne since I have been
  around 14 yrs old. About a year ago I started to use a product called "clear
  Skin Image" by coenzyme technologies. It is literally saved my face from
  further cysts and further scarring. Like you, when my acne wasnt so bad I
  would still get one or two cysts at the time of my period. Now I dont even get
  those. I take 2 pills three times a day on an empty stomach. I dont know if
  this is a side effect but it really makes me feel calmer to (usaully very
  moody with PMS). It is a little pricey but I would pay double for it if I had
  to. Goodluck
 

 

   Good point, JW -- Denise1, 19:56:54 10/29/03 Wed

  I suppose one could spot treat a scar or indent to heal it up and not use it
  all over their face. Good point for people to remember......
 

 

  ALLAN & DENISE1- Retin A & Smoothbeam -- JW, 18:15:44 10/29/03 Wed

  Denise1 I already now that many people are very sensitive to Rentin A. I am
  also very sensitive to Retin A also. I have never used it as a full face cream
  for longer than two weeks because it just aggravated the heck out of my skin.
  Remember what I posted, it was only for a dime size spot treatment; also, my
  main goal was to cause irritation, peeling and redness. This is how I got the
  Renin A absorbed deep into the skin in a highly concentrated amount. I also
  suggested it was not for everybody, but this technique has the potential to
  help very many people even the ones that are sensitive to it. I do caution,
  just don't be as aggressive as I was, not that it hurt me (it only helped me),
  but just cause a little redness to see how your skin does with it and just
  keep on placing it on the mildly red area (un-aggressive) and soon you just
  might get on the more aggressive track as that scar well start to disappear.

  Allan, I want to assure you that it is not the Accutane that is causing you to
  want to take your life. In every case I have read the ones that are depressed
  and suicidal are the ones that are not to happy with the results they are
  getting from their treatment. Just imagine for a second that this stuff
  started to work and your face was clear and you did not have to deal with the
  acne no more, never again having to pass up going out with your friends
  (especially the cute ones). That depression would be no more I assure you of
  that. However, it may return when it is time to get off the stuff in fear of
  it coming back. Talking from experience, if it does work your anxiety will be
  very high it fear of it coming back. It did help me out quite a bit but it did come back
  in my case soon after but they were not as deep. I am currently undergoing
  smoothbeam treatments because I recently had a divorce and my acne came back
  pretty bad. Not as bad as before the accutane just bad enough to want to hide
  my face now and again. If accutane does not work for you try smoothbeam laser
  treatments. I hear it works well for many people (you have to be somewhat
  light skinned toned). So fare after my first treatment my acne has cut in
  half. I am going back for a second one in one week. My face did blister a bit
  causing a small scar but that scar went away after two weeks on its own. Take
  care Allan and hang in there. I also guarantee things will get better, why,
  because if you persevere and not give up something always tends to surface to
  help you along your path. God rewards us like that, we just have to have
  faith, even when you want to tell everybody in this planet to screw
  themselves, don't give up faith and trying to find what works.
 

 

   Blake -- Denise1, 21:25:39 10/27/03 Mon

  Blake; I only do the salicylic acid peels once every 5-6 weeks as it is pretty
  strong stuff...plus, if you do them too often, your skin will grow too
  accustomed. I use Retin A nightly, and I use Super serum twice daily; once in
  the morning, once at night after I use Retin A.

  My skin tends to flake more with Retin A than with the peels, but I use the
  Pure Deming stuff also, like Maya. It has olive oil, vitamin e, other
  nourishing things as well, and doesn't break me out. That's very nice, and
  loaded with DMAE and ALA. Perfect for people with large pores, scars, and
  blotchiness/red marks. It really is a wonderful product. I highly recommend
  it. You can use the Pure Deming and leave it on for a half hour or several
  hours, then wash it off. I use it twice a day, in the morning about an hour
  after I use Super serum, (I usually wash it off after a few hours) then I use
  it before I go to bed and several hours after I have applied the Retin A and
  super serum and leave it on overnight.

  Hope that helps.
 

 

  Denise1 and your regimen -- Blake, 10:05:16 10/27/03 Mon

  Just curious what you use following your salicylic acid peels?CP?What kind of
  moisturizer?I am a 40 yr old male and like you tolerate peels and retin-a very
  well but am fairly knew to the salicylic acid peels.I really like it and do
  know that there will be some peeling but am wondering what you use to minimize
  the heavy flaking?Also how do you get your retin-a in your regimen?Are you
  applying the cp products in the evening and removing them before bedtime then
  apply the retin-a or are you using one on top of the other thru the night.Your
  advice is always appreciated.Thanks
 

 

   Please Continue To POST -- vs, 04:09:04 10/27/03 Mon

  I just want to encourage everyone to keep posting their results with different
  techniques.

  Especially the people who recently have gotten exoderm, please keep posting
  your results.

  and again, what ever happend to KIT. she got her exoderm done and desapeared.
  KIT if your out there, i wanna know how your skin is doing.
 

 

  Robert -- Maya, 20:00:13 10/26/03 Sun

  Actually, ALA and other stuff in the intense gel is very anti-bacterial, so is
  unlikely to break you out. In fact, it is very skin soothing. I'm sure you
  will love it as many others do.

  Keep taking the Vit C orally - it's one of the best things you can do
  internally for acne and scarring, and does not affect copper peptides
  externally.
 

 

  For Maya -- Robert, 19:36:17 10/26/03 Sun

  Thank you for the warning. I guess I'll alternate the two. I just hope the gel
  doesn't break me out. :-(

  I'm taking Vitamin C orally. I wonder if I should stop.
 

 

  Robert - about Puredeming Intense Gel -- Maya, 18:43:49 10/26/03 Sun

  Puredeming are currently offering 2 types - 1 with Vit C and 1 without Vit C
  (it doesn't state that on their site though)..

  The one you've ordered will have Vit C in it - and should not be used within
  12 hours of using Copper peptides. Copper peptides (apparently) corrupts Vit C
  and creates free radicles (or somthing equally awful like that)

  So, either just stick to the intense gel, or alternate daily.
 

 

  Copper Peptides -- Robert, 17:07:05 10/26/03 Sun

  Thank you, Denise, for the detailed info. Yes, I have been exfoliating the
  entire time I've been on the peptides. I'm going to finish off the bottles and
  then reassess my situation. I will say, though, that my skin already looks
  better after only 1 week of using the Mandelic acid. After 2 1/2 months of
  use, the peptides have done nothing visible. Granted, I probably need to go 6
  months or more to see results. If only the Super CP serum hadn't caused me to
  break out ...
 

 

  A warming about smoking & nonablative scar treatments -- Tina, 01:49:50
  10/26/03 Sun

  Hi: Thought I'd would share my experience w/nonablative treatments. A few yrs
  ago I had a derm use Versapulse on my depressed scars. Was supposed to
  nonablatively stimulate collagen like Smoothbeam, Cool Touch, etc. It
  backfired on me. I got major blisters & afterward my scars appeared somewhat
  worse.

  The derm didn't understand what happened & just said he must've been too
  aggressive. That could have been the case, but later I saw a derm named Dr.
  McDaniel in Virginia Beach. He's supposed to be great w/Cool Touch, etc. & is
  on the cutting edge w/LED technology. He said my bad results could likely have
  been attributable to being a smoker at the time of the Versapulse tx. He said
  he had done a lot of the initial Cool Touch testing & that they found Cool
  Touch actually made things worse in some smokers.

  Yet ANOTHER reason to quit!
 

 

   Here's some info. -- Denise1, 00:36:39 10/26/03 Sun

  The General Method

  1. The use of a hydroxy acid slowly loosens and dissolves the scar tissue. For
  most people the Skin Biology hydroxy acids work well. But some persons have
  very tough scar tissue and may need a stronger hydroxy acid to get effects.
  Persons with high skin oil seem to have very tough scars.

  2. The strong copper peptides help keep irritation down and create an
  environment conducive for the rebuilding of new skin to replace the lost scar
  tissue.

  3. As the scar tissue is replaced by healthy skin, the skin, like an elastic
  balloon, pulls itself smooth.

  For Finding the Best Products for Acne Scar Reduction, try Item 300 - Acne
  Scar TriReduction Test Kit

  The key is to improve your skin without causing more breakouts. The Test Kit
  helps you to determine best products for your skin.

  In general, if you have continuing problems with breakouts, the safest
  products for reduction of the appearance of acne scars are the lipid-free
  products - CP Serum with Copper Peptides and Exfol Serum - an aqueous
  beta-hydroxy salicylic acid serum. First try the CP Serum and the Exfol Serum.
  These are the easiest on skin. Use the Exfol Serum in the morning and the CP
  Serum in the evening. Rub the products into the scar area. Test these two for
  2 weeks and see how they work. If your skin becomes irritated, then use less
  of the products.

  If the CP Serum and Exfol Serum are tolerated by your skin, then try to see
  how your skin does with the TriReduction P&R Basic plus the Exfol Cream. Use
  the Exfol Cream in the morning and the Trireduction P&R Basic in the evening.
  This is a little better way to work on scars, but has more of a risk of
  breakouts. If no breakouts, then try this method for 2 weeks.

  After this you can decide which method (CP Serum & Exfol Serum vs.
  TriReduction P&R & Exfol Serum) has the best potential for improving your
  skin.

  Pitted Acne Scars

  Pitted acne scars often respond well to these methods. Such scars are
  difficult to remove with traditional dermatological techniques that try to
  remove scars rapidly.

  The key with pitted acne is to rub the Exfol Serum in the morning into the
  pitted scar on a daily basis. This slowly dissolves and removes the scar
  tissue. In the evening use a copper peptide product. This helps stimulate a
  slow rebuilding of your skin. As the scar tissue is replaced with healthy
  skin, the skin's surface pulls itself flat like a balloon.

  Most people use the beta hydroxy acid at one time of the day, such as in the
  morning and the copper peptide later in the evening.

  Some people use this method but also use a 30% glycolic acid twice weekly to
  speed the process.

  If This Does Not Work Well Enough For You

  Stronger alpha or beta hydroxy acids will speed the procedure but also
  increase the chances of irritation or chemical burns. A 2% salicylic acid is
  about equivalent to a 10% glycolic acid in terms of exfoliation and scar
  removal. The Skin Biology Exfol Serum is a 2% salicylic acid at pH 3.2. Some
  customers and clinics use stronger salicylic acids or 30% to 70% hydroxy acids
  to loosen and dissolve the scar tissue then apply the copper peptide product.

  Such stronger hydroxy acids can be obtained from Estheticians and
  Dermatologists at Spas and Clinics or from www.makeupartistschoice.com or
  www.homepeels.com or www.platinumskincare.com.

  The Method By The Numbers

  1. In the morning, apply the Exfol Serum beta hydroxy acid product to the acne
  scar.

  2. You can apply more beta hydroxy acid during the day. But reduce the amount
  if your skin become irritated from the hydroxy acids.

  3. In the evening, use copper peptide products (cream or serum) on the scar.

  4. The key is to keep working on the scar.

  5. You can use the copper peptide products also in the morning but because of
  the blue color, most people prefer evening use.

  6. If after two months, there is little improvement, then use a stronger
  hydroxy acid.

  Subcision or Needling to Break Down Scars followed by Copper Peptides

  In this procedure, a needle (such as tattoo needle) disrupts the scar collagen
  and stimulates replacement of newly formed collagen. Best results are achieved
  with several sessions. This often used on pitted acne scars or at the margins
  of face lifts. Some scars may be too deep and too hard for hydroxy acids to
  effective loosen.

  Another idea is that certain scars form a barrier wall or "zone-of-stasis"
  that blocks the body's scar removal systems. Scar-clearing macrophages cannot
  penetrate the barrier and blood vessels will not grow through the barrier. The
  subcision breaks down this barrier and allows the body to begin dissolving the
  scar tissue.

  Some estheticians tell us that they use CP Serum or Trireduction P&R after the
  needling and see a much better and faster clearing of the scars. However, do
  not apply the copper peptides until the wound has scabbed over and is no
  longer open or oozing liquid.
 

 

   Robert and others -- Denise1, 00:24:55 10/26/03 Sun

  I just wanted to remind everyone of something. The Skin Biology super serum
  and even the regular serum must be combined with an exfoliant to target scar
  tissue. This is repeated on the Skin Biology site.

  If you are only doing one of the serums and you aren't
  exfoliating....(i.e....causing slight damage to the skin with the peel, which
  is what peels do), then the copper peptides aren't being activated in a way
  that will target scar tissue. It is reiterated on the site that if you are
  doing something at a lower dose (using the Exfol serum combined with a regular
  or super serum), then move up to a peel at 15% or whatever to achieve some
  results. Then, move up to 30%....so forth, and so on. These aren't products
  where you will see miracles overnight. These are products that work *over
  time* WHEN COMBINED WITH PEELS AND EXFOLIANTS.

  I really cannot reiterate this enough. As I've said many times....I got
  results with the regular serum and peels OVER A YEAR'S time. During that year,
  I had a TCA PEEL as well. For me, the Super serum works just fine and ofcourse
  I do peels and Retin A as well. The products, in particular the serums, work
  with peels. You have to be consistant and use them over a period of months in
  order to see improvements. As Maya has discovered, you also have to be careful
  not to smoke as well. Tina even posted that Dr. McDaniel told her that it's
  evident that some non-ablative lasers make scars WORSE in SOME smokers! This
  is what happened to her.

  Anyway....I am going to provide what SB says on their site specifically about
  this so all will understand what is involved in the process of the serums.
 

 

  Mandelic, Lactic, Puredeming -- Robert, 22:57:15 10/25/03 Sat

  Maya,

  Based on your recommendation, I just ordered the Puredeming intense gel. You
  seem to be the Web guru of acne scar treatments. I'll post some feedback in a
  week or two.

  I'm starting to lose faith in the copper peptide products. I like the mandelic
  acid serum and the lactic acid peels, but the CP products have done very
  little for me. (And the Super CP Serum caused me to break out ... Arrggh.) I
  guess I was sucked in by the hype and the MOST IMPRESSIVE Skin Bio website.
 

 

   Just sharing Info on GOOD products -- Maya, 20:50:31 10/25/03 Sat

  Just thought I'd bring to your attention some products I
have been using for some time with great success:

  1. MANDELIC ACID SERUM at 10%
  (cheapest place is
  http://www.skincarerx.com/ecommerce/index.html?category=serum at $30.99 for
  4oz - can also get more info from www.nucelle.com ) - really excellent for red
  marks/hyperpigmentation and also for active acne. This is a mild exfoliator
  that can be applied to the skin daily (much more gentle but more effective
  than glycolic)

  I find using the mandelic daily and doing a lactic peel every 10 days or so
  really helps with red marks and exfoliation with no irritation (I am pale
  Asian skinned).

  2. PUREDEMING INTENSE GEL - wow!! This product is a wrinkle reducing (and
  possibly scar reducing) moisteriser that needs to be applied for 15 to 45
  minutes (or longer) before washing off - leaves your skin feeling amazing,
  hydrated, soothed and smoothed! http://www.puredeming.com/products/ - 2oz
  bottle is $45 - use it daily and it would last around a month (they sell
  smaller bottles and trial sizes too). It's based on the Dr Perricone skin care
  system (so contains good amounts of DMAE, ALA, Vit C-Ester etc..)

  The above 3 products combined (mandelic, lactic and puredeming intense gel)
  make for a very good all round treatment for people with shallow scars and a
  little active acne - or can just be used for wrinkle free skin!

  The top two supplier deliver worldwide - gets to me in the UK from the US
  between 4 and 10 days - both also have excellent customer care.
 

 

  Robert - about Lactic Peels -- Maya, 19:24:49 10/25/03 Sat

  I love them too!! You're meant to leave them on 5 minutes max .. but I have
  left them on for 10 minutes with no problems - you might want to build up
  before doing that.
 

 

  40% Lactic Acid Peel -- Robert, 17:37:47 10/25/03 Sat

  I tried my first lactic acid peel yesterday. It was very enjoyable. It didn't
  burn me like glycolic acid and yet it exfoliated me well. I only left it on
  for 4 or 5 minutes, however. How long can I keep this stuff on? Is 10 minutes
  too long?
 

 

  Michie - Colltouch -- Sweety, 02:24:46 10/24/03 Fri

  Mitchie,
  I never used colltouch but i know that there is a new one in the market
  cooltouch - 3. I think this is the latest and probably a better version of
  cooltouch -2. So ask your doctor about it
 

 

  EXODERM UPDATE -- vs, 23:52:45 10/23/03 Thu

  EVERYONE OUT THERE, keep up your exoderm updates please.

  and what ever happend to KIT?
 

 

   Michie and JW -- Denise1, 19:58:36 10/23/03 Thu

  Michie: If people havn't used Cooltouch II, then they probably cannot give you
  an opinion on it. Don't feel bad, people aren't always here on a regular
  basis. I don't hear a lot about CoolTouch nowadays. Everyone seems to be
  focusing on Smoothbeam. I don't have experience with CooltouchII, but have
  heard good things about it. Sorry, that's all I know to tell you.

  JW: I read various people posting on other boards boards saying that Retin
  A had helped their scars tremendously, as it has mine also. However, I want to
  strongly warn you that many people are just too sensitive for Retin A. Many
  people cannot use it. If you can, then great. Everyone's skin is
  different......

  I was trying to find that article that was posted and I couldn't find it.....I
  skimmed through it quickly a few days ago and I think it was an article that
  recommended Retin A treatment for a cystic skin condition that wasn't acne,
  but was acne-like. I believe that the page was documenting that the Retin A
  treats wrinkling, skin folds, cysts, etc.....it wasn't a study. Sorry for the
  confusion! I hadn't read the article when I first glanced at it. It was
  someone saying: hey, if you want to treat acne and remove scar tissue, go to:
  blah, blah, blah....

  Anyway, that's it. I don't know if you can tolerate Retin A or not. I'm very
  blessed with tough skin, so it doesn't irritate me, though I started off with
  weaker solutions and worked my way up the vitamin A food chain.
 

 

  To Mel--Skin-bio products -- Eve, 16:22:59 10/23/03 Thu

  I used the Super Cop and the Exfol lotion for about 6 months. I did not
  receive any benefit from it, but it is possible I did not use it long enough.
  My scars are very old and may be beyond help from products like these. I
  probably need a more invasive procedure. There are others on this site and
  other sites who have had success with the products. Good luck to you!
 

 

   Skin Biology Products -- Mel, 16:05:18 10/23/03 Thu

  Anyone had particularly good experiences with Skin Bio? Ive just received CP
  Serum and Super Cop, and also the new serums. I am new to this so I have no
  real idea how to apply etc.

  Many thanks
  Mel (Brit)
 

 

   please give me a reply! -- michie, 12:40:20 10/23/03 Thu

  can someone pls answer me??
  i've already posted earlier on asking about cooltouch 2 but nobody replies
  pls!!! :(
 

 

  Question For Denise1 -- JW, 01:37:50 10/23/03 Thu

  Hi Denise. About a week ago, you had posted a message in which you referred to
  studies on Retin A. You stated that the studies show that Retin A gobbles up
  scarred/damaged tissue. You said that you had recently come across a link to
  one such study on another site.

  As a person with shallow scars, that study sounds very promising. I am very
  interested in reading that study.

  Do you know the name of the study or how I can find it? On what site did you
  see the link to the study? Any leads you can give me would be greatly
  appreciated.
 

 

  Covering scars with makeup -- Holly, 21:42:27 10/22/03 Wed

  Does anyone have tips on applying camouglage makeup to cover up ice pick scars
  and depressions in the skin?
 

 

   PK & CitySlicker -- Eric, 18:11:45 10/22/03 Wed

  Hi PK-

  That is excellent news about Dr. Scheibner possibly coming to the U.S. to
  train doctors in treating scars with her unique laser methods. I sincerely
  look forward to it... and to the results that these methods could bring here
  in the U.S. My only reservation is that with such a unique method in the hands
  of so few, this may make prices unfairly high... and putting it out of the
  range of people who would have to turn to cheaper, and perhaps less effective
  and more risky, scar treatment methods.

  Hey CitySlicker- I just wanted to let you know that I really appreciate you
  sharing your experiences with us... and I wanted to lend encouragement also.
  If you remember, Steve's initial impression of his Exoderm was pretty
  disappointing... with improvement anywhere between 10-30%... which your
  results have already surpassed. But Steve also mentioned that by the time he'd
  gone in for his first touch-up, he'd already improved to about 40-50%... and
  so with additional Exoderm touch-ups, you should hopefully see some excellent
  results. I personally think you made a good choice, and that Dr. Rullan is an
  excellent caring doctor for acne scar patients. Please keep us in the loop and
  let us know how you progress.

  Peace out and God Bless...

  -Eric
 

 

  to Cityslicker--exoderm update -- Eve, 17:38:20 10/22/03 Wed

  Just wondering how the recovery from your Exoderm treatment is going? Do you
  still feel it is the most effective treatment you have had so far? I have been
  following several links on other boards about fat transfers, excision and the TCA
  Cross Treatment. Each thread has positive AND negative postings. I did receive
  an email from Dr. Fortes, one of 5 plastic surgeons at the Houston Aesthetic
  Center for Plastic Surgery. This is part of his email: "...deep post-acne
  scars.... respond most effectively to punch excision or excision with a tiny
  scalpel blade. I have performed excisions of this type in the treatment of
  these scars. The more shallow scars can be improved by dermabrasion (sanding
  of the skin). Both of these methods can be performed under local anesthesia in
  my office." I will probably not be having any consultations until after the
  first of the year, and I'm thinking about buying the article on the Cross
  Treatment and taking it with me to see if any doctors ar